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jgemrich
Posted: Monday, June 16, 2008 9:58:27 AM

Rank: Zealot

Joined: 11/15/2007
Posts: 477
Location: Cincinnati
I know the site encourages the "LGS" but we all have a few products that aren't are not readily stocked b/c they are "exotic" for lack of a better term.

but I wanted to compare pricing for a couple of online places b/c I just didn't get it. I've been waiting to get the new Infinity figs for Combined and the new Helldorado figs for Sarrasins.

The 2 stores are www.starplayer.fr - an online french store and www.fantization.com

I chose these 2 b/c they both carry Helldorado and Infinity.

I can get the items at Starplayer for $60.00 after conversion from Euro @ $1.54/Euro. Shipping is free to the US.

At Fantization it costs me $74.96 for the same product and then a minimum of $10.25 to ship it. Total to get it to my door is $85.21.

Now, I'm not one to quibble about a buck here or there. Seriously though? 41% more to buy from an online US store. Ouch. Anyone else experience this? Or is it just Fantization that assumes it has a lock on the market for some of this product?
gregdorf
Posted: Monday, June 16, 2008 10:51:58 AM

Rank: Junior Gamer

Joined: 9/24/2007
Posts: 317
Location: Kansas
Fantization offers no discount for the product you buy from them. What they charge should be about what you can expect a LGS to charge. My biggest grip with them is they carry low numbers on stock and are slow to refill. I would like to see a better online US store that carried both Infinity and Helldorado, but that is not going to happen until Helldorado has a stronger english language support from the parent company.
kainthedragoonx
Posted: Monday, June 16, 2008 11:13:25 AM

Rank: Gaming Incarnate

Joined: 8/14/2007
Posts: 1,594
Location: The TTG Ziggurat (Cincinnati, Oh)
Just an FYI: The War Store is going to start carrying Alkemy, and they are currently working something out for Infinity. mrgreen The War Store will have a booth at Origins and Gencon, and I know they will be selling Infinity at Origins...and probably both Infinity and Alkemy at Gencon! twisted


And yes, TTG had something to do with that! mrgreen


Offical TTG View Point:

We are not against buying stuff from online stores. Where the problem comes in is you go to a game store and play there...without ever buying something. We would like you to support stores when they carry the games you play. But TTG understands that you cannot force your LGS to carry the games you want to play and that it is a stores responsibility to offer you a place that you want to play. The problem is when people play in stores that do offer a great gaming environment without supporting the store's business at all. Think about the overhead and what not that goes into allowing you a place that provides the gaming tables and the environment for you to play the games you love.

We know that not everyone is lucky enough to have a safe, friendly game store to play the games at. The TTG Staff just wants you to support the stores that do. Without them the gaming industry would die. We just ask that you support the Brick and Mortars too! wink




Administrator, Gaming Addict, and Forum Monkey!

Get Your Game On!
Breten
Posted: Monday, June 16, 2008 11:18:05 AM

Rank: Zealot

Joined: 3/24/2008
Posts: 552
Location: Calgary, Alberta, CANADA
I'm also sure that in the case of HellDorado, with the US dollar being weak on the Euro, and the fact he has to import it, his mark up to keep from losing money is probably pretty high. I think the trouble is that Fantization does have a bit of a grip on certain lines, especially those from Europe.

I do think that US online stores charge too much for shipping. Especially to Canada. I can see what you paid for shipping, and $20US wasn't it.

That said in the case of Infinity, my LGS actually has it cheaper than the Warstore. I pay $10.95 CAN for a single blister that's $9.99 on the Warstore. Sadly they order direct from Corvus Belli, so we only see re-stocks a couple times per year. I won't even tell you what my Caskuda cost me, because it was a sweet deal at less than $40 CAN.
gregdorf
Posted: Monday, June 16, 2008 1:02:22 PM

Rank: Junior Gamer

Joined: 9/24/2007
Posts: 317
Location: Kansas
Breten wrote:
I won't even tell you what my Caskuda cost me, because it was a sweet deal at less than $40 CAN.


Sadly I spent way more then I should have on mine. I could not wait, so I ordered direct from CB and with shipping cost and exchange rate it was a little more then retail.

It is cool the Warstore will have stock for Alkemy, I want to avoid ordering any product from overseas until the dollar becomes a little stable.

Breten it is cool that your LGS carries the different product. The main game store in Wichita will only carry product if Alliance will distribute it, I finally got an honest answer out of the owner.
Breten
Posted: Monday, June 16, 2008 2:50:15 PM

Rank: Zealot

Joined: 3/24/2008
Posts: 552
Location: Calgary, Alberta, CANADA
Yeah, the Sentry Box is pretty unique. Sadly his business sense is sometimes lacking. He complains about product that doesn't move, then orders more of the same. Vampire Wars, Fairy Meat, all the Kenzer & Co, GW (inc all Specialist Games models), PP, all Reaper, Ral Partha, Battletech, Void, Vor, Deadlands, Heavy Gear, Jovian Chronicles, Crimson Skies, tons of dead games, all in stock.

But he won't clear it out, and doesn't understand that all that dead stock is costing him money just sitting there. I won't even get started on how much space GW takes up and how much the guy in charge of GW stuff rips the place off. He accuses people of stealing (me), and meanwhile he's got a guy who takes home all the demo stuff from GW, opens the boxes and parts out the bitz and sells the LE figs on eBay, orders tons of stuff they don't carry and walks out the back door with it. All his staff point it out, but he says they're making it all up.

Shops don't get that having stock sit for years is loosing you more money than blowing it out. He's always hoping for that one guy to pay a premium for it all.

DarthSilentBob
Posted: Monday, June 16, 2008 4:14:07 PM

Rank: Junior Gamer

Joined: 8/20/2007
Posts: 305
Location: Wichita, KS
Breten wrote:

Shops don't get that having stock sit for years is loosing you more money than blowing it out. He's always hoping for that one guy to pay a premium for it all.



Basic business school stuff. BUT, as I think we've all witnessed over the years, if most of these guys had much in the way of business sense or financial acumen, they probably wouldn't be in the business in the first place. sad In one of the past incarnations of the gaming shop here in Wichita that Greg is talking about, it was, on a smaller scale, the same situation you mention. Having dead stock sitting around for years hoping to find someone who has never heard of the internet and yet miraculously wanting this product. Luckily for him, he had some smart and sneaky employees so when he would go out of town on vacation, they would have a "boss is gone" sale and mark everything down 20-50% depending on how old the stuff was. And funny thing, they always did a TON of business those weeks and cleared a lot of shelf space for new product. But, the newest owner is much more arrogant and was of the "if you build it they will come" mentality thinking he could attract regionals for CCG's and Clix, and big tourneys and such. But he never put the work in required to do so, and now is subleasing some of his space for other purposes on a part time basis.

"I'm a world-class assassin, f*ckhead. How do you think I found out?" - Mr. Goodkat
Breten
Posted: Monday, June 16, 2008 4:42:18 PM

Rank: Zealot

Joined: 3/24/2008
Posts: 552
Location: Calgary, Alberta, CANADA
It always makes me wonder what a gaming or comic shop might look like if the owner had even a slight clue how to run a business. Sadly, most of them are just playgrounds and ways for the owner and his buddies to get cheap or free product.

Obviously the real business men just look at the bottom line and know it's not worth it.
kainthedragoonx
Posted: Tuesday, June 17, 2008 7:40:03 AM

Rank: Gaming Incarnate

Joined: 8/14/2007
Posts: 1,594
Location: The TTG Ziggurat (Cincinnati, Oh)
Breten wrote:
It always makes me wonder what a gaming or comic shop might look like if the owner had even a slight clue how to run a business. Sadly, most of them are just playgrounds and ways for the owner and his buddies to get cheap or free product.

Obviously the real business men just look at the bottom line and know it's not worth it.



I disagree. See Krystal Keep. Best gaming store ever!


Raji is part owner, and it kicks ass! mrgreen


Gaming Stores can be profitable, you just have to remember that in the end, it's a business, not a club!

Administrator, Gaming Addict, and Forum Monkey!

Get Your Game On!
jgemrich
Posted: Tuesday, June 17, 2008 11:22:03 AM

Rank: Zealot

Joined: 11/15/2007
Posts: 477
Location: Cincinnati
Quote:

Obviously the real business men just look at the bottom line and know it's not worth it.


I concur and disagree with this statement at the same time.

I think the existing LGS model is a business person's nightmare. It is a nitch product that is able to be purchased in abundance on the internet by distributors w/ low overhead and discounts. The avg age of a player is 15 to 25 w/ a low amount of disposable income. Not to mention there are several places for folks to trade merchandise on line.

Add to that the amount of inventory that it requires to keep folks coming back to your store.

So many customers want...the old stuff, the latest stuff and the fringe stuff. It's extremely mutable inventory.

But I think there are several options that allows you the do the brick and mortar LGS and succeed.

A) service consumers in a large metropolitan area. This allows you to keep the inventory moving (even the fringe stuff). I'd never open an LGS in an MSA with less then 500K of people. Also, pick a location near major freeways/roads. It needs to be easy to access. I like ACME games. But it is brutal to get too unless I'm downtown. It is worth the extra rent to get more foot traffic.

B) Have a net presence. you move more product and can keep costs lower. You just have too much trouble surviving without it. Whether you open an ebay store or compete directly on the net you should have the presence and ability to distribute product in this manner. I have a buddy who does trains and he complains as well that if the Local Train store doesn't have a good web site it's dead.

C)Be a destination location. Create a business people want to go to. Display cases, hobby demos, Good lighting, clean, very cool terrain and tables, event days.
Get your consumer base to buy into the store by delivering well above expectations. Figure out these costs and make it part of your business. Don't consider it something that eats into your profit but consider it as something necessary to maintain market share.

D)Product mix. Sell something else. Maybe sell trains (there is crossover in brushes, paints, terrain). Sell high end models... again cross over in inventory. Be a bookstore that sells hobby stuff and gaming stuff on the side. Just have some product mix to capture beyond 1 nitch. This lowers your fixed cost per unit sold and you appeal to more consumers. By selling trains and Games (example) you probably increase your foot traffic by 1.5 to 2x. Essentially it's like moving from an MSA of 500K to an MSA of 1.0M.



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