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Rank: Advanced Member
Joined: 8/23/2008
Posts: 59
Location: Silver Spring, MD
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Good news! All boxes will now contain at least 3 minis. :d/ Bad news! We have to wait till May to see Wave 5. Lets hope there aren't any shipping delays.  Aaron
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Rank: Junior Gamer
Joined: 10/13/2008
Posts: 135
Location: WA
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May isn't that long, I need the time to paint what I already have.
I'm still having trouble deciding on which faction I should concentrate on and the new wave doesn't make things any easier...
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Rank: Zealot
Joined: 3/24/2008
Posts: 258
Location: Chicago, IL
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May???
Ouch. :(
That put a bit of a damper on the excitement over the pics. :(
Oh well, plenty to paint already anyway, and not a whole lot of time between now and then to boot! :)
"Wheels within wheels in a spiral array, a pattern so grand and complex.
Time after time we lose sight of the way, our causes can't see their effects."
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Rank: Artist
Joined: 8/21/2007
Posts: 503
Location: St. Louis, MO
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sucks waiting until May, but some really sweet stuff coming. I must say Avalon is getting some sweet additions. Lotharius is just awesome imo, expert brutal PLUS he gives the templar novices expert brutal.... thats just nasty!
www.doughamilton3d.com
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Rank: Zealot
Joined: 11/9/2008
Posts: 358
Location: Dearborn, MI
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The Raindancers and Meharists were priced at $25 for two minis!
That's painful for the "cheaper" plastic. I still bought them but prices like that are really gonna turn off prospective players.
Current Projects:
Painting Aleph Starter and Caskuda
Terrain: Infinity Smugglers Den, Malifaux Quarantine Zone
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Rank: Artist
Joined: 8/21/2007
Posts: 503
Location: St. Louis, MO
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maybe, i can pick up 2 crappy models for a so so system that i play and not bat an eye. I honestly dont find the prices that different than any other min company. a couple of dollars for something i get that much enjoyment out of isnt all bad. btw, 20.00 for those boxes at miniature market, 22.50 at warstore. so 10-12 dollars each. so not great but not going to scoff over a few dollars.
www.doughamilton3d.com
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Rank: Junior Gamer
Joined: 9/24/2007
Posts: 419
Location: Kansas
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May? that seems like a very long time for something to come out considering that there was painted models of the wave 5 stuff at Gen Con. I am really starting to wonder if it will be worth the effort to push the game if there is only going to be 2 waves a year. I was fairly forgiving with wave 4 because I was thinking, well they are getting Genesis up and running and once that is done they will return the focus back to expanding the game. My big question now is, will there be an increase of product release or is this current rate something that we can expect.
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Rank: Gaming Incarnate
Joined: 8/14/2007
Posts: 2,656
Location: The TTG Ziggurat (Cincinnati, Oh)
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I don't see what the problem really is. So we have to wait a little while. It's not that big of a deal. With wave 4 we are at the point where we can field some different stuff. Run games at 250...it'll work fine. Now, if we are not getting wave 5 before Gencon...we might have different issues...
Administrator, Gaming Addict, and Forum Monkey! Get Your Game On!Razing Kain
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Rank: Junior Gamer
Joined: 9/24/2007
Posts: 419
Location: Kansas
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If you are fine with May, then why is a few months later a different issue.
My thought is this game is starting to stagnate, we have 2-3 characters per faction, depending on if you have the LE. Every faction out there is still limited to use some models in the starter set, with a few additions. This would not be that big of an issue but there is some balance issues between starter sets. I just would like to know if this current release plan is what we can expect for the rest of this year. I still would like to see the dice sold separate from the starter set. I guess it all comes down to is I am spoiled by the other games I play that have monthly releases and can keep my addiction going.
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Rank: Gaming Incarnate
Joined: 8/14/2007
Posts: 2,656
Location: The TTG Ziggurat (Cincinnati, Oh)
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gregdorf wrote:If you are fine with May, then why is a few months later a different issue. Because I want options at 300 points for the tourney at Gencon! 
Administrator, Gaming Addict, and Forum Monkey! Get Your Game On!Razing Kain
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Rank: Zealot
Joined: 11/15/2007
Posts: 995
Location: Cincinnati
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The real questions is with Tin prices coming back down from Early 08 highs of $20K/Ton to 11/12K ton will the higher price point of these plastics be tolerated...especially if producers of metal figs bring their price points back down to attract buyers.
Sure, tin is still double what is was in 2005 but when considering you can get a box of 10 GW figs for $22 looking at 2 or 3 plastic for $25 doesn't seem like any bargin.
Selling for Gen Con: Goal $2000 Earned: $570
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Rank: Zealot
Joined: 3/24/2008
Posts: 258
Location: Chicago, IL
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kainthedragoonx wrote:
I don't see what the problem really is. So we have to wait a little while. It's not that big of a deal. With wave 4 we are at the point where we can field some different stuff. Run games at 250...it'll work fine.
Now, if we are not getting wave 5 before Gencon...we might have different issues...
Well, the problem is, if it was any other company - people would be going bananas over it, upset and up in arms, crucifying the company as a whole, etc. ;) Wave 4 came out in December, right? That's 5-6 months between wave 4/5 - not good. As nice as the figs are, as fun as the game is, to wait 5-6 months for a single release (for your faction or not) is really going to push the patience level of a lot of players. Some 'other games' can get away with this, of course. If you play certain GW armies, for example, you could go years between releases! :( But at the same time, those companies are releasing something on a regular monthly schedule - even if it's not for your faction. Like Greg, I am very interested to hear from the folks in-the-know if Wave 6 will have another 5-6 month wait or if there will be a bit of a speed-up in release dates. I mean, if the gap between Wave 4 and 5 is because of Genesis, or a move to a new packaging theme (no less than 3 figs anymore?), I could understand that. :) But if it's going to be the 'regular' way of future releases, I'd be pretty discouraged, as an average fan.
"Wheels within wheels in a spiral array, a pattern so grand and complex. Time after time we lose sight of the way, our causes can't see their effects."
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Rank: Junior Gamer
Joined: 8/20/2007
Posts: 438
Location: Wichita, KS
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I'm all in favor of repackaging to bring the cost down. Wave 3 was WAAAAAAY too expensive and even Wave 4 is too pricey for what you get. MSRP listed at the Warstore for the 2 Meharists is $23.50, selling there for $21.15, but I can get 2 Nomads Intruders for $15.99 or 3 Alguaciles for $15.99 and so far at least, I get more enjoyment from Infinity. Pricing, ESPECIALLY in this economy, is a big factor right now for a new game. So this is hopefully a big step in the right direction and I'm happy they made it.
BUT May? Really? That's not going to go over very well with the people we're trying to get interested. I'm hoping that Genesis hits as scheduled and gets everyone drooling over all the cool profiles in there and we can all start proxying some of it to get a better feel for what we want to play and that will keep some interest but, I do worry a bit.
And I'll add a vote for the dice to be released separately sooner rather than later. We're all ok with mixing our dice around so far but I know plenty of people that aren't so being able to buy a second set without getting a second starter would be good.
There were horses and a man on fire and I killed a guy with a trident!
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Rank: Artist
Joined: 8/21/2007
Posts: 503
Location: St. Louis, MO
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Dice=spring. think counters and tins ala wm/hordes. guessing faction based, but dont know that for 100% Release schedules intent is to be quarterly. I will be trying to find out a little more detail for you guys.
www.doughamilton3d.com
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Rank: Zealot
Joined: 11/9/2008
Posts: 358
Location: Dearborn, MI
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THe stand for most other companies is about a 1 month release rate, or about a new model a week. Personally I think this is a very aggressive roll out for skirmish games and it sets up a 3-4 year golden age, then creativity seems to stagnate or you begin releasing 2nd editions of the older models. I personnally wouldn't mind a 2 month release schedule as it gives everybody decent breathing room from the business and hobby side.
Month to month releases, I can barely keep up with ONE system on new releases. The players that simply assemble and play I realized could care less about this and the monthly releases isn't even fast enough for them.
But 4-5 month release events is pretty testy. The current prices on the minis make it VERY difficult to push the game (I can never convince folks who even have minis to play a game now, Gensis should help) but a LONG or conditional release rate would make it nigh impossible.
Current Projects:
Painting Aleph Starter and Caskuda
Terrain: Infinity Smugglers Den, Malifaux Quarantine Zone
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Rank: Gaming Incarnate
Joined: 8/14/2007
Posts: 2,656
Location: The TTG Ziggurat (Cincinnati, Oh)
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you can tell I "grew up" with GW. At least every faction get's new models when stuff comes out! I'm not saying I am in love with waiting until May...but I have a lot of work that needs to be done for the conventions and everything, so this buys me time to get caught up. I'm not getting nearly enough time to get it all done...painting, assembling, all of it. Hell I think I need to hire a couple of people just to get my models done!!!!
Administrator, Gaming Addict, and Forum Monkey! Get Your Game On!Razing Kain
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Rank: Artist
Joined: 8/21/2007
Posts: 503
Location: St. Louis, MO
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Magnoguido wrote:THe stand for most other companies is about a 1 month release rate, or about a new model a week. Personally I think this is a very aggressive roll out for skirmish games and it sets up a 3-4 year golden age, then creativity seems to stagnate or you begin releasing 2nd editions of the older models. I personnally wouldn't mind a 2 month release schedule as it gives everybody decent breathing room from the business and hobby side.
Month to month releases, I can barely keep up with ONE system on new releases. The players that simply assemble and play I realized could care less about this and the monthly releases isn't even fast enough for them.
But 4-5 month release events is pretty testy. The current prices on the minis make it VERY difficult to push the game (I can never convince folks who even have minis to play a game now, Gensis should help) but a LONG or conditional release rate would make it nigh impossible. 2nd edition models likely wont be needed considering profiles have already been tested well into the future and then some.
www.doughamilton3d.com
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Rank: Junior Gamer
Joined: 8/20/2007
Posts: 438
Location: Wichita, KS
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I don't have a big problem with quarterly releases for a skirmish game like this with only 4 factions (I know more are coming in the future). So once they get on that schedule and keep it, all is well. The problem is surviving and prospering as a company until that point when they have taken as long as they have to get the last few waves out (including the new date for wave 5). I can't speak to wave 4 yet because I haven't purchased them, but prior to that, the factions were not well balanced at all IMO, so I was hoping for quick releases of product to get new forces on the table to help turn that around. Right now I'm holding off on the Wave 4 buy to wait for Genesis so I can see where the factions are going in the future and decide if I want to stick with the cats or not. So, in effect, I haven't spent any money on Alkemy since wave 3 came out. I hope that being carried by some of the bigger stores and Alliance means that more new people are coming on board to offset the lack of spending from many of us, but it does give me pause. At any rate, bring forth Genesis so that I may bask in its glory. 
There were horses and a man on fire and I killed a guy with a trident!
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Rank: Zealot
Joined: 11/9/2008
Posts: 358
Location: Dearborn, MI
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necromancer120 wrote:
2nd edition models likely wont be needed considering profiles have already been tested well into the future and then some.
No, no, I speak more to quality of models not playability. Take Warmachine for example. Their product line is getting enormous but their Prime book models are still very playable, but the quality of the models is pretty sub-par for my taste. Heck, the new releases lately for Hordes are pretty hideous, but I have Alkemy, Helldorado and Infinity to thank for that. About one of the only things I like about GW is that they re-release new versions of their older models. If they just took the time and effort to make them top notch to begin with they wouldn't have to do that though. My argument is that when a model line gets huge, what kind of challenges await the company based on their expected release schedule?
Current Projects: Painting Aleph Starter and Caskuda Terrain: Infinity Smugglers Den, Malifaux Quarantine Zone
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Rank: Publisher/Designer/Manufacturer
Joined: 3/18/2008
Posts: 56
Location: France
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Hello people, long time no see  I wanted to give you some explanations about all of this. Well first, let me tell you that we don't plan on releasing minis every 4/5 months. We'd rather prefer having new waves every 2/3 month. That being said why this wave will take so long to come ? The first thing is well, we are not Games Workshop, nor Asmodee (I'm sure you've noticed that right ? ) It means we have no huge financial resources. So we can't produce a lot of minis at the same time. And we wanted to give the opportunity as quickly as possible to get your hands on Genesis (in english of course) We are also players like you and we know that money doesn't grow on trees (how lovely it would be) So we work carefuly to make sure that our products will be at the best price. That takes time and this is also the reason why we decided to change the number of miniature per box. This is the only way for us right to lower the production cost as we can't afford to produce more boxes for each wave (the other best to lower this cost, especially for plastic) So now, you might wonder why supporting Alkemy when new waves are about to be released this late. Well it's not because we won't have new mini before May that we won't propose you new things. First : Genesis in english ! We still hope to release it for en of february. We will also work more on organized play programm along with "Wonderfull Doug" and we will add severals new goodies to the galleon store (T-shirts, jewellery...) that will be available for all international communities. In addition Gale Force Nine will release it's Alkemy licensed accessories sets during the spring. That's it for now. I know it is quite frustrating for you (it is also very frustrating for us not being able to propose you the minis we already have) But be sure we will do whatever we can do to support and develop the community ! Thank you much for your feedbacks (good and not) They help us growing and being better. And most of all, thank you for your support. 
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